In a Financial Post article, “patriotic” and “infuriated” Gwen says:
“It’s appalling that our government would agree to this..They don’t consider us real Canadians.”
She also points out the huge risks to renouncing for “Accidental Americans” and others:
“If I was to renounce, I’m exposing myself as a U.S. citizen. I’m stuck spinning my wheels.”
It’s Orwellian.”
Why do all these articles insist on calling us U.S, expats living in Canada or Americans living in Canada. Why is it so difficult for them to understand Gwen, Tricia and most of the rest of us are Canadian?!?
I sympathize with your situation Gwen. Recently, I made my trip to the US Consulate to dump US citizenship. We should be prosecuting the IRS and US Gov as well. They are like a bunch of thugs going after the life savings of innocent Canadians who in reality don’t owe them anything. The Canadian Gov should have stood up to them as bowing down to a bully will only make things worse in the long run. I don’t think my situation will qualify for the Expat Exit Tax. We are still expected to back file for five years and my fear is that they may try to come after people for penalties anyway. Trips to the US, even if we have relatives there, may be out of the question. Good luck with your struggle.
@PatCanadian: Yesterday, I spoke with a 78 year old woman who came to Canada in 1959 and has been a Canadian citizen since the early 1970s.
After her Canadian-born husband died, her bank and the accountants they referred her to have terrorized her to become compliant.
Nothing has been sent yet, but she expects to be “called in” this week to sign.
She has every reason to be able to get a CLN dated back to when she became a citizen. If it was before April, 1973, her CIC file should have a renunciation oath.
The accounting firm never mentioned any of that to her and did not tell her CRA does not and will not collect for IRS.
I told her DO NOT sign anything. but she kept saying “It’s too late.”
How very sad and infuriating. Terrorized is the right word. They should be sued but of course it it would be too involved.
The sad reality is that according to the CRA guidelines and the practice of RBC ( some branches at least), she doesn’t need a CLN OR a copy of her oath. All she is supposed to need is a reasonable explanation as to why she relinquished her US citizenship. She has that already.
@Duke: Her bank is TD Canada Trust. They already asked her where she was born and didn’t ask her any questions about relinquishing. She knew nothing about that–had never heard that word.
This is one person. How many more are being terrorized?!? She only spoke to me because a friend of hers showed her the July 4 story in London.
Despite her terror, she wants to know if there will be a public protest in London she can participate in!
My bank is TD as well. They know better than to ask me. Hope you can help her. It’s a question of cost vs. trouble. As a former IRS deputy commissioner told me- it’s not a legal question or a moral one- it’s a business decision.
@Duke: That “business decision” may be the reason why TD wants to be the engineer of the FATCA train. They have more branches now in the than in Canada and growing, so I think we know where their loyalties are. All Aboard!
I am only a TD customer because of their merger with Canada Trust several years ago. I have never been as happy with TD as I was with Canada Trust. With Canada Trust, I always felt like a valued customer. With TD, I feel like an account.
IRS Deputy Director, banks and the Cons may think this is not a moral or legal issue. I hope we can prove them wrong with our legal challenge. We still need donations to make that happen!
For a long time it was assumed that a Bank could not ask for place of birth.
Does anyone know the statutory basis of that assumption?
Without any research, I have come to the conclusion that it may not be illegal to ask for place of birth. What is illegal however, is what a Bank may do with that information.
I donated again yesterday, and will do so next pay cheque as well. We need to make this happen! What happened to the 78 year old woman reminds me of what almost happened to my mother. Luckily, in my outrage and disbelief, I found Calgary411 and IBS, and I was able to gather enough information to convince her that she lost her US citizenship in the early 70’s and to not listen to the accountants.
It may be legal to ask but it isn’t required to answer.
I am not certain it is legal to ask. I know in employment hiring, an employer is not permitted to ask where someone was born. It violates the Human Rights Code.
After hiring, the employer needs a birth certificate to confirm date of birth–but not place of birth. That information must be kept private and used only for that purpose. For example, Human Resource staff maintaining employment records should never share place of birth with the manager, payroll staff or anyone else.
At least that is the situation under the Ontario Human Rights Code. National origin is also a protected ground under the Canadian Human Rights Act that applies to banks.
However, the Implementation Act overrides all other laws. CRA guidelines say banks are not required to ask for place of birth. They do not say banks must not ask for place of birth, so the rules of the game have changed–just like CBA wanted.