Transfer of Records from CRA to IRS Doubled to 315,000

Elizabeth Thompson of CBC is reporting the number of FATCA records transferred from CRA to IRS doubled from 2016 from 2015.

Banking records of more than 315,000 Canadian residents were turned over to the U.S. Internal Revenue Service last year under a controversial information sharing deal, CBC News has learned.

That is double the number transferred in the deal’s first year.

The Canada Revenue Agency transmitted 315,160 banking records to the IRS on Sept. 28, 2016 — a 104 per cent increase over the 154,667 records the agency sent in September 2015.

The article points out the flip flop of Trudeau, Brison and Goodale.

NDP Revenue Critic Pierre-Luc Dusseault finds the increase in reporting “surprising.” He says:

“I don’t see how there would be 150,000 more accounts reportable to the IRS in one year. It is something I will look into.”

Lynne Swanson has no idea why the number has doubled but finds the number low considering the number of people affected by FATCA.

Swanson hopes the Republican controlled Congress and President Trump will repeal FATCA. She is still waiting for the Federal Court of Canada to intervene to protect Canadians in Canada.

“A foreign government is essentially telling the Canadian government how Canadian citizens and Canadian residents should be treated. It is a violation of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms.”

21 thoughts on “Transfer of Records from CRA to IRS Doubled to 315,000

  1. @Lynne, re: ” I understand the reason you are not able to post at Brock was because you were posting under more than one identity, not because of what you were posting. But I hope Sandbox will not become a place for fighting out those differences ”

    No problem Lynne. Will drop it. It’s well past time to put the pain of being bullied and ostracized from Brock, along with being subjected to a FATCA witch hunt behind. The only way for that to happen is to stop playing in the Sandbox while peeking in at Brock like a dejected outsider. Both must stop for my own mental health, though I appreciate you welcoming me here.

    But I hope Lynne, that you don’t mind if I make one last short comment on the matter, which is that what you understand (from those who voted me out) as the ‘official’ reason for my banishment is mostly just a good excuse to get rid of someone whose loud voice gets in the way of what certain people want to see happen.

    And on that note, WhiteKat has ended her ninth life. Take care Lynne, and everyone else with whom I’ve had the opportunity to debate and discuss over the last 4+ years. I hope that before another 4+ years passes by, there will be no more Maple Sandbox or Isaac Brock Society.

  2. @WhiteKat.

    “If we don’t believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don’t believe in it at all.” – Noam Chomsky

    I just noticed the quote at the bottom of your post and it reminded me of the destructive rioting at UC Berkeley a week or so ago. Even though I’m no fan of Trump or the alt-right types I was shocked when I watched that protest against a right-wing speaker (a perfectly legitimate protest) morph into a full-fledged riot (not legitimate at all). Clearly the people who participated in that riot didn’t really believe in the concept of freedom of expression. Or maybe they just felt like smashing something that evening. How ironic that this happened at the very campus which was ground zero for the freedom of speech movement back in the day.

    • Thanks WhiteKat. I understand the reason you are not able to post at Brock was because you were posting under more than one identity, not because of what you were posting. But I hope Sandbox will not become a place  for fighting out those differences.

      You have not posted anything here that would prevent you from participating.  For some bizarre reason, some of your posts went to Spam and then disappeared but that was not at attempt to silence you.When I located them,  I posted them.

      a couple of other people’s comments also went to Spam.  Again, this is not an attempt to silence anyone.  in over four years, we have only placed one person in moderation due to some very chilling comments that person made.

      You are very welcome here.

  3. @Embee, I wish we could help Canadians ditch US citizenship without having to go through all the incomprehensible, expensive back filing, exorbitant renunciation fee, etc.

    I believe that an alternate approach to dealing with US slave persecution (FATCA) of Canadians, as opposed to focusing on getting the master (USA) to be nicer (RBT, repeal of FATCA), is to pursue avenues that would support the removal of slave status (US citizenship) as a solution. In other words, “renounce and rejoice” as one ADCS director is so fond of saying, but not just for those who can afford to. I think such an endeavour would be supported by many who frequent Brock, and may even be a more timely and more likely hope for freedom than the current Canadian FATCA IGA lawsuit, the US FATCA lawsuit, or the proposed future CBT lawsuit. See: http://isaacbrocksociety.ca/2015/06/19/to-cbt-or-not-to-be-an-american/

    Yet no groups involved in the FATCA/CBT fight have taken this on, at least not to the best of my knowledge. USA can insist on CBT for Americans. Canada can say that as Americans we have obligations to the USA. Fine. Be that way. I mean not REALLY fine, but if we are no longer US citizens, there is nothing more they can pin on us for being ‘Americans living in Canada.’

    • @ WhiteKat
      That’s an interesting idea … at least for those who have no use whatsoever for their USness. A simple statement to the State Dept. — I don’t want it, you can have it, it’s no use to me — and you’re FREE. No back tax or information form filing, no complicated exit procedure, no fee — just fare thee well and here’s your CLN. I would wish for that too.

      Of course, non-US citizens with a long ago temporary presence in the USA, like myself, shouldn’t even have to inform the State Dept. or the IRS about where they are living outside the USA, as long as all taxes while living there were paid before leaving. In a saner world this is how it would be. For those who have a use for their USness, like wanting to keep the right of return, then RBT is the fairest solution of them all.

      Anyway, another front in the confrontation has just opened up. Nigel Green and Jim Jatras are collaborating on a lobbying effort to get FATCA repealed. I wish this had materialized before the FATCA damage began (banks should have and could have easily paid for this) but striking now while there is a window of opportunity (the RNC platform) is still good news to me.

  4. People really should read the guidance.
    http://www.cra-arc.gc.ca/tx/nnrsdnts/nhncdrprtng/gdnc-eng.html
    Accounts under $50,000 US account were only to be reported in 2016, high value account were to be recorded in 2015.
    “Lower value accounts

    8.78 The review of preexisting individual accounts that are lower value accounts on June 30, 2014, must be completed by June 30, 2016.”

    Lynn another issue I brought up was it allowed Canadian FI to use Canadian dollar. Can you please see about talking to government to get this rule changed.

    from 7.35 ……
    ” However, a Canadian financial institution may treat the Canadian dollar at par with the U.S. dollar in respect of a particular year when the Canadian dollar was, at all times in that year, valued at less than the U.S. dollar.”

    Canadian dollar is well below par eliminating this would eliminate a bunch of people being discovered. I have talked about it before.
    Lynn you would be an excellent choice to talk to Minister of National Revenue to fix this.

    Can You please do this?

  5. @ WhiteKat
    Can’t count the number of times I’ve had to readjust my perception of reality but I still keep plodding on trying to find the truth. Been told it’s “out there” but it’s not something that’s easily detected or absolutely verifiable. Sadly we find ourselves living in a fog of lies. I keep thinking re: the FATCA/FBAR/CBT injustice/insanity that reason must prevail and then I see that in so many other cases it hasn’t (e.g. people can still be mind manipulated into thinking that war is necessary, even after all the times it was proven not to be) but, one thing’s for certain, there’s no chance of reason prevailing if we don’t keep pushing for it to happen. You’ve done more than your fair share of pushing and hopefully, when it feels like the right time, you’ll be back in the fray again. Another thing’s for certain — you are NOT a loser. You’ve scored too many points in countless comment sections for that to be possible.

    • Hi Embee. Thanks for your reply. And sorry for seeming like such a headcase. I waffle back and forth between feeling like I must be a terrible person to have been silenced at Brock and thinking that is so NOT the case. Logically my adult brain says I don’t deserve to be silenced, and that my viewpoints are valid albeit in direct opposition (on some key points anyway) to those who control IBS. Unfortunately, my inner child(we all have one) doesn’t think logically and has been all torn up over what has been a painful ostracization, particularly having taken the Canadian FATCA fight so personally and seriously.

      To be shut out of the most important website on the planet where one can go to to discuss, collaborate and work together to make change regarding the US FATCA witch hunt has been really hard to take. I am no longer liked nor spoken to by IBS people who at one time appeared to my ‘friends’, and this is directly the result of being very vocal at Brock with respect to arguing different perspectives than that held by ADCS-ADSC/ADCT/Brock admin.

      If IBS is pro free speech and pro grass roots movement, why is it that I in particular have been banned from there especially considering the degree to which I have been involved in this fight over the last 4 years (public protests, newspaper and radio interviews, lots of letter writing to CDN politicians, endless commenting on articles, significant monetary donations to the CDN lawsuit, volunteering/interviewing for plaintiff role, etc)?

      It appears to me that the ‘American expat’ mindset (as opposed to a more Canadian perspective) has taken over at Brock. Or maybe that was always the case. Perhaps that is the frame of reference for the majority of US persons in the world so it is not so surprising. However, regardless how the majority think at IBS, I find it extremely hypocritical that IBS claims to promote free speech, yet not so much if one consistently and insistently challenges the agenda of those who control the site. Yes, I did get aggressive with some of my commenting and broke a rule (US persons file their US taxes and don’t break rules remember!), but in my defence I experienced a history of regular bullying at IBS for arguing a more Canadian-centric perspective, and I don’t see other people (one in particular) being banished for their inability to debate an argument without resorting to bullying and ad hominems – why? – because they support ADCS morphing into ADCT, unlike moi.

      I was told in the explanation for my banishment (an explanation which I had to ask for) that the viewpoints I express at Brock are “idiosyncratic”. Who is Peter Dunn to make that judgement about what I, from a purely Canadian perspective, think with regard to FATCA and CBT, and how does this support justification for banishment?

      “If we don’t believe in freedom of expression for people we despise, we don’t believe in it at all.” – Noam Chomsky

  6. @Embee, re: “Glad you still have those urges”, only fleetingly…done with it all…only losers get rejected from FATCA support communities.

  7. @Embee re: “good at injecting truth and reality”

    A dangerous pastime. Most people generally don’t care about truth and reality – that is not unless it meshes with their truth and reality.

  8. Here’s an indication that the Canadian government may be becoming sick and tired of US tyranny. On Canadian news today and just now on the US CNN there has been an interesting story. Canada is to give stranded travelers temporary residency due to Trump’s travel ban on 7 Muslim majority countries. Canadian Immigration Minister, Ahmed Hussen, who is a Somali born Canadian citizen spoke about this. Please see the following:

    http://globalnews.ca/news/3212865/canada-to-offer-temporary-residency-to-travelers-stranded-by-u-s/

  9. Thanks Lynn for the new information and all your work on this. The number of records going from CRA to IRS doubling is certainly not good news. With all of Trump’s negative activity in his first week as president, I wouldn’t expect much from him. However, there may come a time when other governments, including Canadian government, get good and sick of it all. In the meantime, I wait to see what happens with the lawsuit.

  10. @ Lynne
    I can’t count the number of times I’ve found myself being so grateful to you … for your articles, for your testimonies, for your interviews, for helping ADCS … and now again … for your collaboration with Elizabeth to put the injustice of FATCA back into the Canadian spotlight. How I wish we still had our “Two Moms Protest FATCA” tagteam (Atticus In Canada and WhiteKat) to smack down some of the ignorant comments that popped up at CBC today. Even if I was still able to log in there to comment I have never had and still do not have the energy, writing talent and persistence that those two had. Anyway there are some commenters who do get it … at least in part.

    Do you happen to have a link to your CBC radio interview that I’ve seen a couple of references to at Brock?

    • It was on CBC Radio World News on a few of their newscasts.  Unfortunately, it was not on the newscast that is online so I don’t know how to get it.  There was also a short clip from Dusseault.

      Does anyone know how to get it and post it?

    • @ Lynne
      CBC Radio One The World This Weekend is coming up in a couple of hours. I’ll listen to it LIVE, just in case they play your interview on that episode.

    • Nothing on The World This Weekend. Looks like the FATCA data transfer story got trumped by the new US travel bans.

    • And now by the Quebec mosque shootings..  I am physically ill at what is happening in the world.

    • Hey Embee. Thanks for the memories. Had just mentioned “once in a blue moon” Canadian FATCA media coverage the prior day, and then the CBC article came out. By the time I caught it, 500+ comments had already been made so was almost too late to do any educating, but felt that old familiar urge and for a split second was tempted to slam all the ignorant comments down. Then remembered I had just said the day before in my self pity for being a Brock reject that I would never write anything FATCA related again anywhere.

      What I got out of scanning the 900+ comments before CBC shut the commenting down, is that most Canadians either won’t/don’t get it or don’t care to. What else is new? I mean seriously, can you blame them? With all that is wrong in the world, a bunch of Americans living in Canada wanting to have their cake and eat it too, is just not going to register as a human rights abuse with the average Canadian. I know this is not the reality for many of us, but that is the image we are fighting.

      I still remember the ‘Yankees go home’ vitriol from a man at the Ottawa parliament hill protest that AtticusInCanada and I organized (after the ‘two mom’ protest). He seemed on our side at first when he spoke with us. The he left and came back about an hour later with a print out of some article which painted FATCA as being about ‘Americans living in Canada’ – his sympathy all gone out the window. This is what we are up against. My fear is that the more we connect with anything American, the less fellow Canadians (including our politicians and legal system) will give a darn.

    • @ WhiteKat
      Sometimes I think we just keep ending up back at square one (damn that Ida Pomme) but then I see the lawsuits slowly progressing (except ADCT which is in a waiting mode to see whether anything comes of the RNC platform) and people still valiantly protesting the injustice so there’s nothing to do but to keep on keeping on. Glad you still have those urges … you are so good at injecting truth and reality into comment sections.

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