With sadness and gratitude, we announce that Ginny Hillis (Canadian Ginny) has withdrawn as a plaintiff

cross-posted from adcsovereignty wordpress blog

August 24, 2017

UPDATE UPDATE for Canadian FATCA IGA Lawsuit in Federal Court: Plaintiff Change

This update is to let you know that for health reasons, Ginny, one of our three Plaintiffs, has withdrawn as a Plaintiff in our Canadian FATCA IGA legislation.

We are so grateful to Ginny for having been being a part of our team for so many reasons. Her good humour, wit, and wise counsel based upon her experience as an attorney has helped us get through many difficult days during the litigation. She was one of the very few who never had any doubts whatsoever about taking on the personal risk and hardships of being a Plaintiff in a lawsuit against the power of her own government. She provided a service not only to us, but to the entire community worldwide harmed by compliance of their own countries with the foreign FATCA law.

Plaintiffs Gwen and Kazia, the ADCS Board, and our supporters are indebted to Ginny for the sacrifices she and her family have made and we all wish her the very best.

ADCS Board

4 thoughts on “With sadness and gratitude, we announce that Ginny Hillis (Canadian Ginny) has withdrawn as a plaintiff

  1. Pacifica777

    Regarding my last comment, I was thinking about the last sentence in s. (1) “such a person may be considered a lawful permanent resident at birth”, and wondering if it could cause problems. I don’t know much about this, but I note that s.(1) uses the words “may be,” not “is,” and I saw that US Customs and Immigration Services, on its site states that,

    “This person may, however, be considered a permanent resident at birth and able to receive a green card through creation of record,” (for what it’s worth, the criteria to be met are listed as: “You were born in the United States to a foreign diplomat; You have had residence in this country continuously since birth; You have not abandoned your residence in the United States”).

    So, it looks like, as well as not being a citizen, a green card is not issued automatically to a child born to Blue-Listed foreign diplomat, which is good, too, as a green card could also trigger US “tax personhood” and FATCA problems.

  2. Francois

    You are living almost your whole life in the country you live now. Your father was a Dutch citizen and worked temporarily in the USA for the Dutch government. You were born in the USA but moved as a baby or toddler to the Netherlands. Your father is Dutch and consequently you are too. Because you were born in the States you are also an American citizen.
    You attended school in The Netherlands and you know everything about Dutch history and speak Dutch (hard wired). Later on you learn English although the skill level will never approach the Dutch control of the language.
    For more than half a century (56 years) you are living in Holland. You left the USA when Kennedy was being elected. You paid taxes during 43 years in Holland. A country known for having the highest tax rate in the world (almost 70% of all the money ends up in the Dutch tax office). This is by the way not the case for Walmart or Starbucks in Holland, they pay 2 or 3 percent in taxes?
    Therefore it has been difficult to save money for the elderly day. Meanwhile you are sixty two years old and close to retiring.
    All of a sudden several bank accounts are refused or denied, it is difficult to find a bank that accepts a so called US Person, renewal of your mortgage seems impossible, investing in a capital management fund is also refused. You are supposed to fill in a so called TIN number?? And after some investigation you discover that you are supposed to file taxes in the USA. Absolutely a surprise! Especially since the American Consulate had your home address for ages. Why were you never informed? More than eight million Europeans where astonished by this unknown tax law that only two countries in the world follow, which means that you are tax accountable even if you don’t live in the concerning country and have no possessions in that country and never
    used or will use any benefits. The USA is one of them it turned out. A complete shocker.
    NOW you have to file taxes over a period of many years. The tax rules are completely different. Supposedly one is not obliged to pay double for the same tax sort. But some taxes are different and the risk is that you pass the threshold and have to pay again. For decades you have been saving for a house in order to sell it just before retiring. One of the very few things that are ”tax-free” in Holland because you pay taxes when you buy the house! Not in the USA it seems where selling a house can cost you money due to capital gain tax.
    Because America is far away the prices of US Accountants are sky high and because it now turns out that you must file taxes also in the USA this burden will repeat year after year until the day you die.
    Although you are very fond of the USA and even proud to have this unique relation, it should be better to give up your American citizenship for practical and financial reasons. Almost impossible however! All of a sudden the Renunciation form to apply cost a lot (minimal of $ 2.350,-). Social Security number and birth certificates are not available in Holland which you need to proceed. The enforced statement of an American lawyer is also expensive. All to gather it cost you many months and a lot of money. However; new surprise: you have to be up-to-date with filing your taxes – in the current situation this will take many years. A 20.000 Euros final bill is not an exception for an average person.
    It seems all very unfair considering you have been seriously law-abiding your whole life. Dutch law because you have no choice and also the country and place you grew up, attended school, found your partner, worked for years. Even if you would decide to go live in the USA it will be difficult to bring a long your wife and children; they do not even have Green cards and have different rules to follow.

    Please think about it: in between two countries, the danger of no bank account, mortgage, and losing life savings at risk. For what real reason?
    I apologize for my bad English. Dutch would have been much easier.
    A FATCA victim

    1. nobledreamer-Tricia Post author


      Welcome to Maple Sandbox, even though it is always a sad reason that brings us together. We are all in the same boat, suffering in one form or another due to the gross overreach of the United States. Many here are from Canada with the same issues (“Accidental” Americans). It is incredibly unfair and hard to believe after the last five years, that the governments have not rectified the situation.

      And after some investigation you discover that you are supposed to file taxes in the USA. Absolutely a surprise! Especially since the American Consulate had your home address for ages.
      Why were you never informed? More than eight million Europeans where astonished by this unknown tax law that only two countries in the world follow, which means that you are tax accountable even if you don’t live in the concerning country and have no possessions in that country and never
      used or will use any benefits. The USA is one of them it turned out. A complete shocker.

      This has driven me crazy. I cannot understand how the US, the other governments, the banks, the tax agencies – all accept this aggression because it is “U.S. law.” Why on earth would countries accept this over their own laws and citizens? Totally ignoring the fact these laws were never enforced. Never. So many lives destroyed by extremely punitive sums from OVDP 2009. Retirements lost. Families broken. One would think that if the real point was to bring people into compliance, they could have chosen to have a campaign for informing, a grace period for entering the system. And most importantly, a way to exit that does not cause so much anxiety and so much money. Obviously this is a huge money grab and they gain much much more from penalties than from taxes.

      I am sad for Europeans as so far, here in Canada, our banks are not closing accounts, refusing mortgages and so on. So it is easier for people to “remain under the radar.” It is difficult to imagine how one makes a choice in your situation.

      At any rate, please do take time and read our resources, posts and feel free to post any ideas/questions etc, that you have.

      Are you aware of the accidentals in France who are organizing a lawsuit?
      If you are looking for others in Holland, EU etc, in the same situation as yourself, it might be helpful to contact them to see if they can put you in touch.


      an email sent this week from Fabien Lehagre, president of AAA:

      Chères toutes et chers tous,

      A date, les fonds propres de l’Association des Américains Accidentels (AAA) sont d’un peu plus de 5500 euros.

      Sur les 342 américain(e)s accidentel(le)s identifié(e)s, 191 ont d’ores et déjà adhéré(e)s. Il reste donc un potentiel d’adhésion de 151 personnes soit 151 x 75 = 11325 euros.

      Aujourd’hui, j’ai eu rendez-vous avec un associé et un collaborateur du cabinet Lysias Partners de Jean-Pierre Mignard (http://www.jpmignard.fr/jean-pierre-mignard/), avocat de François Hollande.
      Ils sont très intéressés par les différentes actions contentieuses décrites dans l’étude juridique et sont prêts à nous défendre et à nous représenter.
      La particularité de ce cabinet est qu’ils sont pluridisciplinaire est qu’un des associés est un spécialiste sur les questions de protection des données.
      L’autre particularité de ce cabinet est qu’ils ont un réseau très très important dans le milieu politique français et européen mais également avec la presse française.

      Demain, j’ai rendez-vous à 15H00 avec Patrice Spinosi (https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrice_Spinosi) du cabinet Spinosi-Sureau.
      Avocat classé parmi les plus influents. Il a représenté/représente entres autres Nicolas Sarkozy et la ligue des Droits de l’Homme.

      A 18H00, rendez-vous avec le Conseiller Amérique du Nord de Jean-Yves Le Drian au Ministère des Affaires Etrangères. Je vais l’informer que le recours pour excès de pouvoir sera déposé avant le 3 octobre (date butoir pour déposer le recours) par un des 2 cabinets. Le choix définitif du cabinet se fera jeudi 21 septembre au plus tard.

      Afin d’être en mesure d’initier les différentes actions juridiques dans les mois qui viennent, je vais avoir besoin de VOUS et de votre participation financière.

      Soit à travers votre adhésion à l’AAA pour les non-membres, soit à travers une participation financière envoyée directement sur le compte bancaire de l’association dont vous trouverez le RIB ci-joint.

      Les honoraires du cabinet Lysias Partners pour déposer le recours pour excès de pouvoir qui est à déposer avant le 3 octobre 2017 sont de l’ordre de 6000 à 7000€ et il faudra compter entre 6 à 18 mois pour l’ensemble de la procédure étant entendu que notre objectif final sera de saisir le Cour de Justice de l’Union Européenne.

      Des actions civiles et pénales pourront également être initiées par les membres qui souhaitent attaquer (et gagner sans trop de difficultés) les établissements bancaires en ligne pour discrimination. L’idée étant pour ces actions individuelles, de mettre en place une rémunération du cabinet au forfait (négocié par l’AAA) avec un % de rémunération selon les résultats obtenues.

      Je compte sur vous pour donner les moyens financiers à l’AAA d’être représentée par un grand cabinet d’avocat (le choix ne sera pas simple vu le niveau des 2 cabinets) car c’est maintenant que je vais avoir à mon tour, besoin de vous.

      Merci à vous,

      Fabien Lehagre
      Président de l’Association des Américains Accidentels

      Google translation:

      To date, the funds of the Association of Accidental Americans (AAA) are a little over 5500 euros.

      Of the 342 accidentally identified Americans, 191 have already joined. So there is still potential for 151 people to join, ie 151 x 75 = 11325 euros.

      Today, I had an appointment with a partner and a collaborator of the firm Lysias Partners of Jean-Pierre Mignard (http://www.jpmignard.fr/jean-pierre-mignard/), lawyer of François Hollande.
      They are very interested in the various contentious actions described in the legal study and are ready to defend and represent us.
      The peculiarity of this firm is that they are multidisciplinary is that one of the partners is a specialist on data protection issues.
      The other peculiarity of this firm is that they have a very important network in the French and European political milieu but also with the French press.

      Tomorrow I have an appointment at 3 pm with Patrice Spinosi (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patrice_Spinosi) from Spinosi-Sureau.
      Lawyer ranked among the most influential. He represented / represented among others Nicolas Sarkozy and the League of Human Rights.

      At 6:00 pm, meet with the Councilor North America of Jean-Yves Le Drian at the Ministry of Foreign Affairs. I will inform him that the remedy for excess of power will be filed before October 3 (deadline to file the appeal) by one of the two cabinets. The firm’s final choice will be Thursday, September 21 at the latest.

      In order to be able to initiate the different legal actions in the coming months, I will need YOU and your financial participation.

      Either through your AAA membership for non-members or through a financial contribution sent directly to the bank account of the association of which you will find the attached RIB.

      The fees of the firm Lysias Partners to lodge the appeal for excess of power that is to be deposited before October 3, 2017 are of the order of 6000 to 7000 € and it will take between 6 to 18 months for the whole procedure being understood that our final objective will be to refer the case to the Court of Justice of the European Union. https://www.leetchi.com/c/association-de-association-des-americains-accidentels

      Civil and criminal actions may also be initiated by members who wish to attack (and win without much difficulty) online banking institutions for discrimination. The idea being for these individual actions, to set up a remuneration of the firm to the package (negotiated by the AAA) with a% of remuneration depending on the results obtained.

      I count on you to give the AAA the financial means to be represented by a large law firm (the choice will not be simple given the level of the 2 cabinets) because it is now that I will have my turn , need you.
      Google Translate for Business:Translator ToolkitWebsite Translator

    2. Pacifica777


      You wrote, “Your father was a Dutch citizen and worked temporarily in the USA for the Dutch government.”

      Depending on what his job was, eg, if he was a diplomatic officer listed on the US Dept of State’s Blue List, it’s possible that the child was not born a US citizen.

      I don’t know if you are aware of this exception – or perhaps you are, but it doesn’t fit this person’s circumstances. But just in case it’s helpful, I’ve pasted below two sections of Immigration and Nationality Act, s. 101.3, with a link to the full text.

      Status of person; Definition of foreign diplomatic officer, 8 CFR 101.3(a) (1); (2).
      Immigration and Nationality Act, s. 101.3(a)
      “ (1) Status of person.
      A person born in the United States to a foreign diplomatic officer accredited to the United States, as a matter of international law, is not subject to the jurisdiction of the United States. That person is not a United States citizen under the Fourteenth Amendment to the Constitution. Such a person may be considered a lawful permanent resident at birth.
      (2) Definition of foreign diplomatic officer.
      Foreign diplomatic officer means a person listed in the State Department Diplomatic List, also known as the Blue List. It includes ambassadors, ministers, chargés d’affaires, counselors, secretaries and attachés of embassies and legations as well as members of the Delegation of the Commission of the European Communities.”

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